Last Monday, 18 March 2013, I was present again at BNR
Newsroom, the weekly program of the Dutch business radio station BNR, hosted by Paul van Liempt.
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Presenter of BNR Newsroom, Paul van Liempt Picture copyright of: Ernst Labruyère Click to enlarge |
This week’s topic was the Dutch Commercial Real Estate (CRE)
market. Regular readers of my blog know that the Dutch CRE market is still in
very big trouble, with a vacancy rate of 16% at the end of 2012.
The first guest of the evening was Professor Hans de Jonge
of the Technical University Delft.
De Jonge has been chairman of the so-called ‘Offices Summit’,
a thinktank for the Dutch CRE market, whose goal it was to find out how the
problem of (structural) vacancy could be solved.
In his role as chairman, professor De Jonge has been strongly involved in the
creation of a general covenant for the CRE market, which purpose has been to reduce vacancy
of Commercial Real Estate to 6% from the current 16% within ten years. Paul van Liempt asked him
what went wrong with this covenant, after signing it.
In spite of the fact that I wasn’t able to ask questions on
behalf of Ernst’s Economy for You, I consider this a must-read interview, as it
supplies valuable insights in the disturbed Dutch CRE market. Therefore I print
an (almost) integral transcript of this interview:
Paul van Liempt: How is
the image of Dutch Commercial Real Estate abroad?
Hans de Jonge: Historically, Dutch CRE had a good reputation: stable, with a quite transparent market and with generally fine
yields. A few years ago, this reputation deteriorated. Mainly due to
overproduction on the offices market and at the same time a dropping need for office space. This situation led to the infamous vacancy in The Netherlands. This vacancy made investors nervous. On
top of that, a rookie supervisor of the DNB - on his third day in action - stated in an interview with Het
Financieele Dagblad (www.fd.nl) that the third crisis in The Netherlands would be
'commercial real estate'. This interview has been quoted in the Frankfurter
Allgemeine and the New York Times. Since that moment, the foreign
investors have been wondering if investing in Dutch real estate would be a sensible
thing to do.
Paul: Is the
core problem overcapacity?
Hans: Sure.
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Hans de Jonge, TU Delft Picture copyright of: Ernst Labruyère Click to enlarge |
Paul: You are also chairman
of the "Offices Summit" (a thinktank for the Dutch CRE market). Last
year a covenant has been drawn in The Netherlands on how to fight the
(structural) vacancy of CRE. What has happened until now?
Hans: Not much. The
covenant was based upon four pillars:
- 1. Making regional agreements on demand and
supply, in order to prevent that more buildings will be added to place that
already have overcapacity.
For example: at this
moment we have still twice as much capacity in planning for development than there
is demand for CRE
- 2. Knowing better how
much supply there is. We still know very little about the existing supply of
CRE
- 3. Transparency in The
CRE market. At this moment, the registered rents and contracts don't give a
just image of the market.
- 4. A compensation-for-demolition
fund in order to make demolation possible for CRE without a future.
Paul: Now you state that
very little happened. Could you call the covenant a failure until now?
Hans: No, I don't agree
with that. The covenant has been signed. That is not a failure. What went wrong in this particular situation, is that not all stakeholders stuck to the agreements in this covenant. Some
parties respected the agreements in the covenant and others didn't.
Paul: Which parties
didn't stick to this agreement?
Hans: I'm very disappointed
with the municipalities. After the covenant had been drawn, the steering group
was dismissed. Mission accomplished. The covenant was ready. After this event, this
covenant became a case of the local governments, municipalities and other
market parties. These stakeholders had to take care of the deployment of the covenant. This is when things started to
falter.
Paul: What would have
been a better solution for this steering problem?
Hans: When the central
government would have been in the lead!
Paul: Will this ever
happen?
Hans: Minister Schultz -
Van Haegen (Minister of Infrastructure and Environment - EL) said about this: this is a problem that primarily should be fixed
within the regions and municipalities. I don't see a large role for me in this
process.
She was actually right about that. However, the same parties that should have
been in the lead, are now calling for coordination by the central government. The covenant is not
mandatory, you now. Some parties in the region did join forces. They are actually doing what
we agreed in the covenant.
Paul: The covenant
contained some fierce goals. The vacancy at the end of last year was 16%: offices that were for rent or for sale at the time. The ambition of the Offices Summit was to bring
this vacancy rate back to 6% within 10 years. Are we going to make that?
Hans: No! Not if we go on, like we did last year.
Paul: How can we change
the targets, in order to make those more realistic?
Hans: We should not
change the targets. We should improve our efforts to meet those targets! Those
targets are fine. What we should do is deploy the agreements in this covenant.
This covenant has been agreed upon with all parties involved: central and local
governments, private and institutional investors, project developers, building
companies, the banks, the users of these buildings; everybody was at the table.
Insiders predicted that we would never reach an agreement, but we did! Against all
odds. Even Germany called us to ask how we did it. They said that in Germany it would be
impossible to get all parties at the table. We managed to do so!
The next question is,
however, how can we deploy the agreements that we have agreed upon. If we would
just do so, we would have a fair chance to meet the desired reduction in
vacancy.
Paul: Still, a
reduction to 6% vacancy in ten years. You said that we are not going to make that...
Hans: No, I said that we are not
going to make that, if we remain on the same path as now. Currently, some
people are just going through the motions. That is not enough!
Paul: Do you think that
these people will ever start to put more effort in this covenant?!
Hans: Until now, when I
looked around, I saw that too little effort and energy had been put in the deployment of the covenant.
Paul: If people continue
with just going through the motions, what will happen then?
Hans: At one particular moment,
the market will start to do its job. Then the blood will spatter on the walls six
foot high. You must remember, we are in the middle of a market. At one moment
the NMA (Dutch authority for competition) visited me. They said: what you are
trying to do is controlling the market. Perhaps, you should let the free market
do its job. My response: we could do that. We really could, but we shouldn't do
so.
In other words: this
is a bad idea. Please, understand me correctly: I am not against the free
market. But if we leave the current policy unchanged, the vacancy rate will
continue to soar in the coming years, until vacancy rates of 20% - 25% are
reality. This might only take a few years. At that moment, the
vacancy is not just a problem for institutional and private investors. Then it
would have become a societal problem.
Martine Wolzak (reporter of Het Financieele Dagblad): what should the central government do? A
special levy on building? A building stop?!
Hans: No, no, no. The
only thing that the central government should do, according to the covenant, is
enabling a levy on building. Without this levy, it is impossible to fill the
demolition fund (see pillar four - EL). With this levy, people cannot act as
freeloaders. That is all that the central government has to do.
At this moment, I and other
parties state, that when local initiatives stay away like they do nowadays, the
central government should have a coordinating and facilitating role in this
process. By the way, at this moment the central government is more and more
willing to take this role after all.
Paul: With that 'going
through the motions' policy of some stakeholders. Where will the vacancy rates
go?!
Hans: I cannot tell you
that. F.i. the Amsterdam region tried very hard to fight vacancy and they
managed to keep the vacancy rate about equal, by transforming office buildings
into other purposes.
Martine: Talking about
Amsterdam. In this region all involved parties seriously tried to deploy the
agreements in the covenant. In spite of their efforts, they didn't make it. Is
it not the underlying problem of this covenant, that as soon as it was signed,
everybody started to renegotiate matters into his own favour?
Hans: That is not how I
see it. After the covenant had been signed, a number of incidents happened in
the market. The disappointing offer on the Uni-invest portfolio. The outcome of the
Eurocommerce sale. This is when market parties started to think: "we
are trying to make agreements in order to change the imminent nose-dive from
the CRE market into a successful emergency landing. At the same time, bargain-hunters are
purchasing CRE from the lower end of the CRE portfolio, in order to sell it at
bargain prices! That is not acceptable for us! We quit!". That is
basically, what went wrong.
Paul: The building of CRE
continues; these offices remain vacant and for sale / for rent. In the
meantime, there are people advocating a building stop. Is it not time to deploy
such a building stop?
Hans: This sounds like a
typical 'parliamentary solution'. There have been several proposals by MP's: a
building stop, a general building stop. A plan to withdraw two old square
meters for every new square meter of office space, by demolition or restructuring
of office buildings.
The problem is: there
is not 'a' market. There are enormous differences between regions. And when
f.i. a multinational company visits Amsterdam and states: "We are looking for 45,000 square meter
of office space. We have looked for this in the market, but we didn't find it.
We would like to build such an office ourselves". At this moment, this designated law would
hinder this initiative. That would be very peculiar. You should not lock up the
market, but look at things sensibly.
First: All the empty
space, on which municipalities already have planned how much they could earn
from it, should be striken as building terrain. There is much more terrain registered as building space, than there is demand for in the market.
Second: Even the
reserved space, on which already building permits have been supplied, could be
striken when building is not desirable. This is a dangerous thing to do, as
this could bring claims.
The last thing that
should happen, is that somebody in a supervising role should negotiate with all
of the aforementioned market parties in order to come to building areas that
could expand, building areas that should shrink and building areas that can
stay as is. As a matter of fact, this is what has been laid down in the covenant.